2006 LE Timing Chain?

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linarema
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2006 LE Timing Chain?

Postby linarema » Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:17 am

Took the Pathy to the dealer for a second opinion and while there they noticed a "buzzing/whining noise from the timing chains" and recommend replacing.

I've not noticed the buzzing/whining (other than my own :lol: ) and the quoted price was a bit high ($1960).

Is there any way to really know if it's time to replace the chains? I'm at 210K miles.

Thanks for your thoughts!


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smj999smj
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Postby smj999smj » Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:56 am

Without removing the front timing cover, the only way to know if the upper timing chains need replacing is the giveaway "whining" noise that has become familiar to many VQ40DE engine owners. To me, the noise is similar the sound of an old, Ford power steering pump that is on it's way out. The noise will increase and decrease with engine speed and the more the chains where into the plastic tensioner faces, the louder it will get. Eventually, they will start to ride on the hardened steel, tensioner plungers and if left unrepaired, it could cause the timing chain to jump, resulting in bent valves and possibly worse. The typical price of repair at independent shops is around $1200-$1400 for the basic job. With high mileage, some may want some "add-ins," such as replacing the primary timing chain and tensioner, as well, replacing the water pump and thermostat, and, if due, radiator hoses, serpentine belt and serpentine belt tensioner. The "proactive" type might also go ahead and replace the rear timing cover while it's apart, as there have been some low oil pressure incidents on these engines due to the failure of the oil gallery cover gaskets on the rear timing cover.
Not all of the VQ40DE engines experience the issues with the upper timing chains. First of all, it's limited to 2005-2010 model years. The issue was caused by poor quality control when making the upper timing chains, which were manufactured by Borg-Warner. As the tooling stamped the chain links, it wore and eventually wore to the point that some of the chain links were stamped with sharp edges that can cut into the plastic face of the chain tensioners. Whether there was wear or not on the tooling, how much wear existed if it did exist, coincides with whether the engine would develop the problem and at what mileage it would surface. Some have had no problems, some have had it occur with less than 30,000 miles on the engine, some have had it occur with over 100,000 miles and anywhere in between. Mine had to be replace at 84,000 miles on my 2006 LE and at 148,000 miles on my 2008 SE (although the noise probably started at around 125,000 mi.).

linarema
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Postby linarema » Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:11 am

smj999smj wrote:Without removing the front timing cover, the only way to know if the upper timing chains need replacing is the giveaway "whining" noise that has become familiar to many VQ40DE engine owners. To me, the noise is similar the sound of an old, Ford power steering pump that is on it's way out. The noise will increase and decrease with engine speed and the more the chains where into the plastic tensioner faces, the louder it will get. Eventually, they will start to ride on the hardened steel, tensioner plungers and if left unrepaired, it could cause the timing chain to jump, resulting in bent valves and possibly worse. The typical price of repair at independent shops is around $1200-$1400 for the basic job. With high mileage, some may want some "add-ins," such as replacing the primary timing chain and tensioner, as well, replacing the water pump and thermostat, and, if due, radiator hoses, serpentine belt and serpentine belt tensioner. The "proactive" type might also go ahead and replace the rear timing cover while it's apart, as there have been some low oil pressure incidents on these engines due to the failure of the oil gallery cover gaskets on the rear timing cover.
Not all of the VQ40DE engines experience the issues with the upper timing chains. First of all, it's limited to 2005-2010 model years. The issue was caused by poor quality control when making the upper timing chains, which were manufactured by Borg-Warner. As the tooling stamped the chain links, it wore and eventually wore to the point that some of the chain links were stamped with sharp edges that can cut into the plastic face of the chain tensioners. Whether there was wear or not on the tooling, how much wear existed if it did exist, coincides with whether the engine would develop the problem and at what mileage it would surface. Some have had no problems, some have had it occur with less than 30,000 miles on the engine, some have had it occur with over 100,000 miles and anywhere in between. Mine had to be replace at 84,000 miles on my 2006 LE and at 148,000 miles on my 2008 SE (although the noise probably started at around 125,000 mi.).
Thanks SMJ....I looked at the quote and did not include any of the "proactive" items. I did notice that without labor the cost in parts alone is around $600 (cams, timing chain, guides, tensioner, crank seals). The rest is labor (it is the dealer afterall).
I did hear the whining myself, esp when flooring it on the interstate.
Guess I'll bite the bullet.

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Postby smj999smj » Tue Sep 25, 2018 1:11 pm

You can get aftermarket part "kits" for a lot cheaper than the dealer parts. Or, you can get dealer parts from places like NissanPartsDeal.com. You could look up the parts on such a site (which are genuine Nissan parts) and print out the list with the total and maybe negotiate a better price with the dealer. It might save you some $$.

linarema
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Postby linarema » Wed Sep 26, 2018 1:44 pm

smj999smj wrote:You can get aftermarket part "kits" for a lot cheaper than the dealer parts. Or, you can get dealer parts from places like NissanPartsDeal.com. You could look up the parts on such a site (which are genuine Nissan parts) and print out the list with the total and maybe negotiate a better price with the dealer. It might save you some $$.
So I had the car at my mechanic today for oil change and asked him about the timing chain. He recommended not doing it. He said I do oil changes every 3K miles and not needed. So now not sure who to believe.

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Postby palmerwmd » Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:35 pm

Believe SMJ ;)

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smj999smj
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Postby smj999smj » Wed Sep 26, 2018 5:13 pm

The bottom line is if it's making the timing chain "whine" or not? Obviously, I can't hear it for myself. I also don't know if your mechanic is familiar with the timing chain issues of the VQ40DE. Best advice I can give you is to educate yourself about the problem with the information that's available. A good start is Nissan technical service bulletin NTB09-128, which you can download from here:

https://x.nissanhelp.com/forums/local_l ... &keyid=831

There are also many YouTube vids that show VQ40DE engines making the noise, although some don't exactly sound the same on a video as they do in person. Do a web search and you'll find plenty of information; remember to not just do a search for Pathfinders, but Frontiers and Xterras, as well, as they also have the problem and there are like more Frontier topics on the issue than for the Pathy. If you do actually have the problem, more frequent oil changes nor different brands/types of oils won't make any difference. The problem isn't caused by maintenance but by a manufacturing fault. There are some class action law suits seeking reimbursement for its claimants, but I believe Washington state is the only place that has any recourse for those that have paid out of pocket for the repair.

linarema
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Postby linarema » Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:45 am

smj999smj wrote:The bottom line is if it's making the timing chain "whine" or not? Obviously, I can't hear it for myself. I also don't know if your mechanic is familiar with the timing chain issues of the VQ40DE. Best advice I can give you is to educate yourself about the problem with the information that's available. A good start is Nissan technical service bulletin NTB09-128, which you can download from here:

https://x.nissanhelp.com/forums/local_l ... &keyid=831

There are also many YouTube vids that show VQ40DE engines making the noise, although some don't exactly sound the same on a video as they do in person. Do a web search and you'll find plenty of information; remember to not just do a search for Pathfinders, but Frontiers and Xterras, as well, as they also have the problem and there are like more Frontier topics on the issue than for the Pathy. If you do actually have the problem, more frequent oil changes nor different brands/types of oils won't make any difference. The problem isn't caused by maintenance but by a manufacturing fault. There are some class action law suits seeking reimbursement for its claimants, but I believe Washington state is the only place that has any recourse for those that have paid out of pocket for the repair.

Thanks SMJ and Palmer - I appreciate the guidance!


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