bumpy suspension

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lionbull
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bumpy suspension

Postby lionbull » Tue Jan 01, 2013 7:51 pm

Greetings,

I have searched and still have not found a resolution that makes sense to me. I just changed my rear shocks to blistens. The ride is no different than the old ones with 130k+ miles. I read about air lift and spring replacement but they firm up the ride. Does this not make the ride even more bumpy? I know if i got stiffer spring for my car it would get bumpier. I am a newb but I just want someone to explain to me how stiffer springs will stop the harsh bumpy ride.

Thanks


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Captain
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Postby Captain » Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:21 am

Installing springs with increased load capabilities will make your ride much harsher. Are you looking to make you PF ride more car like? If that's the case you cloud have softer springs installed along with airbag. But this would make the PF useless

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Captain
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Postby Captain » Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:23 am

Tires also make a big change. A P rated tire will be more forgiving than a load D or worse E rated

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NVSteve
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Re: bumpy suspension

Postby NVSteve » Wed Jan 02, 2013 9:48 am

lionbull wrote:Greetings,

I have searched and still have not found a resolution that makes sense to me. I just changed my rear shocks to blistens. The ride is no different than the old ones with 130k+ miles. I read about air lift and spring replacement but they firm up the ride. Does this not make the ride even more bumpy? I know if i got stiffer spring for my car it would get bumpier. I am a newb but I just want someone to explain to me how stiffer springs will stop the harsh bumpy ride.
Are you saying that your ride is currently too harsh, as in too stiff? Or by "bumpy," do you mean bouncy? The stock suspension is really soft and bouncy. One of the first mods I did was replace the springs & shocks. It is firmer, but it is no longer bouncy like it was at stock. I can now drive over a big bump without feeling much of anything, whereas before my suspension would bottom out with a big bounce.

lionbull
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Postby lionbull » Wed Jan 02, 2013 4:11 pm

It is not bouncy as in soft. It is bumpy as in harsh. It makes a bang! and bottoms out. I will at least get an alignment since i know i need it. It feels unsettled but that is a different story. Anyway, back to my rear shocks, I feels like it will rip my pathy apart sometimes, especially when it feels like its jumping around on a bumpy road.

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ShipFixer
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Postby ShipFixer » Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:07 am

lionbull wrote:It is not bouncy as in soft. It is bumpy as in harsh. It makes a bang! and bottoms out. I will at least get an alignment since i know i need it. It feels unsettled but that is a different story. Anyway, back to my rear shocks, I feels like it will rip my pathy apart sometimes, especially when it feels like its jumping around on a bumpy road.
Kinda like the rear end booms over a bump, unsettles the front and makes the whole truck unbalanced?

You're bottoming out in the rear. Pathfinders come with droopy rear springs pre-installed. AirLift 1000 with 5-7 psi is the cure. That plus the Bilsteins makes the truck very different...

DanJetta
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Postby DanJetta » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:16 am

I think what lionbull is describing is what I'm experiencing (described in another post). It's like the springs are too stiff and there's not enough give... you feel every single bump and fault in the road, right?

What year/package do you have?

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ShipFixer
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Postby ShipFixer » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:00 am

DanJetta wrote:I think what lionbull is describing is what I'm experiencing (described in another post). It's like the springs are too stiff and there's not enough give... you feel every single bump and fault in the road, right?

What year/package do you have?
Yes, what he and you describe is unfortunately how the truck rides stock. I've never test driven another Pathfinder that drove differently than mine did, and there was nothing mechanically wrong with mine to begin with. The OEM shocks are cheap orifice-damped affairs with lots of high speed compression damping (bad) and little low speed compression damping (also bad)...like all OEM shocks, but these were particularly awful. They also have the life of a service life of a mayfly. Add that to fairly soft springs in the rear that let you hit the bump stops on a regular basis and the ride isn't terrific.

It feels like it's overly stiff springs, but this is what's really happening. Check out where your bump stops hit the metal; can't say you'll absolutely see that it's been in regular contact but you usually would.

A small boost in the back from the air springs will keep you off the bump stops. Bilstein HD's or any other decent shock will give you better dynamic performance: good low speed compression to fight wallowing, body roll, etc. and softer high speed compression to soak up the bumps.

Some people jack up the air pressure in the AirLift; you really don't have to, and frankly I find that anything above 10 psi in an unloaded condition will outmuscle the rebound circuit in the shocks, making the truck feel both over sprung and under damped. It can get very bouncy if you start going over things larger than expansion joints. Or at least bouncier than I prefer...

Anyway, I think you're asking lionbull but I have a 2005 SE V-6 with 4WD. There's little difference in suspension components from truck to truck though. If you search the forum or the service manual I think you find that the difference is slightly shorter springs in the 2WD and different shocks and struts on the SE Off Road...

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NVSteve
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Postby NVSteve » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:23 am

Shipfixer has it right. If you are bottoming out, the springs are too soft, not too stiff. There's no such thing as a stiff OEM spring on the R51. I agree that changing out the shocks will help to a certain extent, but if you were bottoming out before, you will still bottom out with a new shock, although the rest of the ride should be somewhat improved. And yes, the bigger the wheel + shorter sidewall = harsher ride.

tcjensen1
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Postby tcjensen1 » Sat May 04, 2013 12:28 pm

Maybe this explains my "odd handling" complaint. When I push my '05 pathfinder around a corner, it almost feels like there's a hinge in the middle of my SUV, with a disconnect in communication between the front and rear. The shocks are 205,000 miles old, and my other car is a Honda s2000 that I time trial and autocross, so no doubt I drive the pathfinder harder than most. I looked and indeed, there is a "clean" surface area where bumps stops have repeatedly been hit - front and rear. I already ordered Bilstein HD's, but now I'm thinking I could benefit from new springs too. What do ya'll recommend in combo with the Bilstein HD's and "spirited for an SUV" road driving?

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Zen_master
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Postby Zen_master » Mon May 06, 2013 6:49 pm

In many of the consumer reports a harsh ride is one of the knocks on the R51 generation Pathfinder. I don't know if it is the fact I have a later model R51 or because it's an LE V8 but I consider the ride on my truck to be rather plush. It's not like driving a Buick but it is much better than my Jeep Cherokee (XJ) and in some cases it handles bumps with more grace and aplomb than my wife's 2009 TSX.

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Postby skinny2 » Mon May 06, 2013 7:38 pm

Zen_master wrote:In many of the consumer reports a harsh ride is one of the knocks on the R51 generation Pathfinder. I don't know if it is the fact I have a later model R51 or because it's an LE V8 but I consider the ride on my truck to be rather plush. It's not like driving a Buick but it is much better than my Jeep Cherokee (XJ) and in some cases it handles bumps with more grace and aplomb than my wife's 2009 TSX.
CR can blow it in my mind...it's a truck. Compared to these car-based utes...yes it might ride a little rough. My wife's MDX takes the bumps better but it has 90k less miles and honestly I think it's not so much better from a jarring standpoint, but it's a lot quieter over the bumps. My PF has some pronounced "thumps" and "bangs" when hitting large bumps but it actually doesn't ride that bad in my book. I was in a 2013 Acura RDX recently that jumped around over big bumps similar to the PF.

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cgray
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Postby cgray » Mon May 06, 2013 9:33 pm

If you are seeing lots of body roll around corners try replacing your sway bar bushings. I noticed a big difference in the handling when I put in new ones. Fairly cheap too, I think around $20 in parts total.

DanJetta
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Postby DanJetta » Wed May 08, 2013 8:50 am

Don't underestimate the power of what you hear. I think part of why the ride feels so harsh is because everything inside the car is so cheap and rattly, so the ride is perceived as being harsher than it really is. I drove through downtown Baltimore with noise-cancelling headphones on (as a joke with my wife) and I noticed that the ride seemed a lot better. The inside no longer sounded like a giant baby rattle. Well, it did, but I couldn't hear it.

When I hit a pothole in my wife's Jetta, I only hear the suspension working. When I hit a pothole in the Pathfinder, I hear the entire dash shifting, the door internals rattling, the hatch banging and every other plastic part inside the car vibrating in some form. It sounds like an all-out collision.

domestique
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Postby domestique » Sun Jun 09, 2013 6:27 pm

DanJetta wrote:Don't underestimate the power of what you hear. I think part of why the ride feels so harsh is because everything inside the car is so cheap and rattly, so the ride is perceived as being harsher than it really is. I drove through downtown Baltimore with noise-cancelling headphones on (as a joke with my wife) and I noticed that the ride seemed a lot better. The inside no longer sounded like a giant baby rattle. Well, it did, but I couldn't hear it.

When I hit a pothole in my wife's Jetta, I only hear the suspension working. When I hit a pothole in the Pathfinder, I hear the entire dash shifting, the door internals rattling, the hatch banging and every other plastic part inside the car vibrating in some form. It sounds like an all-out collision.
What!?

I have nothing rattling, banging in my 2008 V8 LE.

If anything my ride has become too loose in my mind (somewhat bouncy/swaying) not nearly as bad as my old Explorer when the engine clips broke but I will look into the Sway bushings.... thanks cgray!


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