Pushing the Limits of Towing

[ValleyWalker]

I specifically bought the Pathfinder due to it's outstanding towing capabilities!
My question is simple;
Am I ok?!!!

Specs:
Vehicle:
2005 Nissan Pathfinder
Drilled/Slotted Rotors and towing braking system added
Weight Distribution hitch and bars.

Trailer:
2000 Sunline Travel Trailer (26' or 28')
Gross Weight 7000

I loaded the TT w/ approx. 80% of the supplies that would stay inside of it, then had the TT weighed.
TT Weight at 80% loaded: 5380
Weight of TT WHEN HITCHED to the Path: 4760

I hope I've given everyone enough details but I wanted to pose this question to the community since you guys are the ones who've already explored these issues.
To that end, am I ok the way I am now or should I do any upgrades to the engine? Go to the 2008 V8?

I really appreciate any help you guys can offer.

[disallow]

whats the tongue weight?

Keep in mind that the pathfinder does specify a limitation on 'front facing area', limiting it to 64 sq ft. Thats 8 x 8, which I exceed, but don't seem to have an issue.

My rig is 5500lbs loaded, with a 400lb tongue weight. I wouldn't go long distances with it, say more than 200-300 miles. And I'd want to keep it on the flats, limit the hills and grades.

t

[AZ_Path]

Sounds like you are still within the max rating, but near the edge of it. What are your driving conditions likely to be? Any high winds or long hill climbs? Things like wind, ambient temperature, and grade will be much more significant when you are towing near the max rating of the vehicle.

I'm not pulling a TT so I don't have to worry about the front facing area as you do, but as far a weight goes we're similar. Under normal conditions for me (high temps and moderate hill climbs) the Path does great. Earlier this year I took a trip where we had some extended hill climbs on a 7% grade with high heat. The engine temp did increase and the computer limited the engine RPM automatically to avoid overheating. Everything worked correctly, and we just completed the hill climb at 45 MPH or so. See this thread for more if you're interested. http://www.thenissanpath.com/viewtopic.php?t=10777

This past weekend I just installed the intake manifold spacer from XPS. http://extremetruckperformance.com/ The HP and torque gains in the 3.5K to 4.5K RPM range really impressed me and I thought the price for performance was better than most any other mod I've seen. I haven't towed with it yet since I just got it installed, but a test drive last night after completing the install felt very good in the mid - upper RPM range. You might consider one of these since you're towing near the limit. This should improve high climb capabilities a good bit.

And if you haven't added the air bags to the rear springs yet that is another good investment.

These above two mods along with the WDH and brake controller should be all you need. I would start off with an easy drive to get used to how everything handles and how much power you have on a grade.

[AZ_Path]

I wouldn't go long distances with it, say more than 200-300 miles. And I'd want to keep it on the flats, limit the hills and grades.

t

Have you thought about adding the intake manifold spacer? Seems like a big benefit to people who are towing large loads.

[ValleyWalker]

I'll check out the XPS links and am curious about that. How much do the air bags in the rear end cost?
I've towed this trailer multiple times w/out issue, the distance has usually only been between 75 -150 miles.
I'm just concerned about longevity and doing it right

[AZ_Path]

I don't think any of the mods have as much impact on longevity as much as they just help to tow safely. The rear air bags are a fairly inexpensive, less than $100 online. Does your rear end sag? If you're towing now without much sag you may not need it. I don't have any experience with a WDH. That may take care of the rear sagging for you.

[ValleyWalker]

The WDH takes care of that. I have no issues with sagging.
When driving I do turn off OD and put the 4x4 in auto. seems to handle exceptionally well like that.

[AZ_Path]

Well if you don't have any sagging then I probably wouldn't worry about it.

Do you notice a difference between 4x4 vs 4x2? I would think 4x4 is not necessary and probably makes the engine work harder. I'm not knowledgeable about 4x4 though so maybe others could comment.

[ValleyWalker]

I agree, intuitively I thought 4x4 would be less desireable and began driving in 4x2. I noticed the vehicle was swaying a little (everything was balanced very well !) So finally I experimented and turned on the 4x4 auto and found the sway immediately disappeared.
Next time I'm towing the TT, I'll try driving in 4x2 first and see how it handles.
I'm sure someone must have already covered the issue of whether to tow in 4x4 vs 4x2

[ValleyWalker]

Ok I took the Path the Path and Travel Trailer to be weighed today. Here's what I found:
2420 = Path Front Wheels (GAW)
5860 = Path Total Front & Rear (TT hitched but not on the scale)
Note: book says 5800 max.
10,500 = Path & TT combined
4760 = TT alone but still hitched to Path
5380 = TT alone on scale

Can I use these numbers to calculate/estimate my Tongue Weight?
Ex:
5380 = TT alone on scale
-4760 = TT alone but still hitched to Path
620 Tongue Weight???

Also, on a side note, I drove to the scales and back (approx. 60 miles round trip) in 4x2 and the Path handled remarkably well. So I don't think I'll be towing in 4x4auto unless the roads are slippery or something.

[AZ_Path]

Can I use these numbers to calculate/estimate my Tongue Weight?
Ex:
5380 = TT alone on scale
-4760 = TT alone but still hitched to Path
620 Tongue Weight???

Hmmm..... That would seem reasonable, but if that works I would also expect you to be able to add the individual weight of the Path and the TT as measured and have it equal the combined weight. The #'s you posted don't do that.

5860 + 4760 = 10,620 (vs 10,500 that you measured)

There is an extra 120 lbs there somehow. Was there a bit of incline or decline before or after the scale?

Note: book says 5800 max.

Is this the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) according to your door placard?

[ValleyWalker]

Your math is off slightly I believe...
you are using the 4760 # when you should be using the 5860 #

4760 lbs represents the weight of the TT when it is hitched to the the Path (which is not sitting on the scale).
5860 lbs represents the weight of only the TT on the scale (attached to nothing)
The number I am missing to make your equation accurate is the weight of the Path all by itself. My 5860# represents the Path when the TT is hitched but not sitting on the scale.
So I guess thearetically 5860 represents Path + (Tongue Weight added by TT)
I guess today I'll be weighing the Path all by itself

[AZ_Path]

Your math is off slightly I believe...
you are using the 4760 # when you should be using the 5860 #

4760 lbs represents the weight of the TT when it is hitched to the the Path (which is not sitting on the scale).
5860 lbs represents the weight of only the TT on the scale (attached to nothing)

Either I'm confused or you are lol. Your 1st post with #'s said the 5860 lbs represents the Path with the TT hitched but not on the scale. In this post you're saying 5860 lbs is the weight of the TT on the scale but not hitched. Did you mean to suggest that I should be using 5380 lbs in my calculation? If so, that just makes the #'s further off.

5,860 + 5,380 = 11,240 (Now you're 740 over instead of 120)

If you use 5,380 instead of 4,760 your double counting the portion of the TT that the Path is carrying.

So I guess thearetically 5860 represents Path + (Tongue Weight added by TT)
I guess today I'll be weighing the Path all by itself

Yes, 5860 should represent the Path + tongue weight but the math doesn't work out that way with your numbers as I first calculated. There must be some degree of slope before or after the scale. This will throw your #'s off.

If you're going back I would try an weigh the tongue weight alone (and avoid all this math ). If you can drive only the tongue over the scale and then unhitch from the vehicle, the trailer jack should be the only thing touching the scale. This should give you a good estimate assuming your jack is pretty close to the hitch receiver.

[ValleyWalker]

2420 = GAW Front (Front Axle only on scale and hitched to TT)
3440 = GAW Rear (Rear Axle only on scale and hitched to TT)
5860 = GAWR (Both Axles on scale and hitched to TT)
5100 = Both Axles of Path (Path only NOT hitched to TT)
5380 = TT only on the scale (NOT hitched to TT)
4760 = TT only on the scale (hitched to Path)
10,500 = GCWR (Both Path & TT)


So I'm assuming:
5860 (GAWR)
-5100 (Path only)
760 Tongue Weight??
600** max. tongue wt. recommended by Mfg.

6000 GVWR
2775 GAWR FR
3500 GAWR RR

That's everything except actually weighing the Tongue Weight which I haven't done.

[disallow]

If we assume that your tongue weight is the difference between #3 and #4, you are over on your tongue weight by 160lbs. Probably not good, given the short wheelbase of the pathy... WDH could help, but I assume you had the levelling bars installed while you were weighing this?